It seems the bands have a really hard time, but how is it actually?
Deviloof that seemed to be the new big band with interational fans kind of did a scam on crowdfounding (alot of that money didn’t go into the DVD, just pure profit).
Julika who just released another killer MV that seems to have high production values - are openly begging their foriegn fans to order their merchandise etc.
And then imagine the bands who are only active in Japan, it cant be easy to make any money on it.
I wonder if even Kyo who is the hardest working mucisican recently in jrock, does he earn any magical numbers like top artits in the west would do?
Anyone know how it works? I Have the impression that these new bands with cute boys give up quite fast then start working as hosts.
How is it to earn money in Japan on music? How is the system even structured, is it different from the west? What is your common thoughts on it? Of course if you sit on some knowledge, please share.
Kinda the same issue worldwide: you don’t live on music incomes anymore. Even more, it’s a big loss for a huge part of bands.
Bands hardly get paid for shows, physical sales ain’t that high, streaming income sounds with “full of lulz”, and every single merch is funded by the band, which its income will allow a bit of autofund for next merch. Renting stuff, MV location, everything comes from the dudes pockets… except for the biggest or if you know ppl in there.
I guess listeners still think that signing a contract or being in a label give you an income advance $$$ or something like that. BTS, one or both doesn’t even give you a free studio to record songs. It makes finding you where and when you perform with your band, doing all the communication things for you, sh*t like that.
For exemple, we all know how tough being in a kpop band is: the label pays for everything when the kids won’t even touch a single $ for years before being able to pay back what they cost. Well, it’s not that different there : you pay for everything before being able to earn enough before make it fund the next thing.
And if the label paid for something, well… as Rui mentionned it, you’re screwed
Jiluka is doing fairly well domestically. Most of their fans are well into their 20’s and 30’s, have expendable income, and they keep a stable attendance. But lately a handful of Tiktok teens are begging them to go to the states and with the current travel expenses it would cost the band 15 grand (USD) just to fly there with their basic staff and equipment. So, simply put, if overseas fans want the band to come abroad and play for them they will have to do way more than streaming on Spotify for pennies (that go to the label anyway and not the bandmembers themselves). I’m rather impressed how, knowing this, people still try to promote Spotify more.
Aside from that, as others mentioned, the cost of keeping a band in asia is pretty high with low returns.
Edit: Seems I replied to the wrong comment. Sorry, on mobile and confused
The most of the income is liveshows (a lot of bands don’t like “netogya” even if they bought all their merch), merch is number 2 or 3 (if they are scumming or selling checkis, japanese are always joking that cheki is literally money from nothing, most of bands are selling tons of them every liveshow)
They have to pay to play in the livehouse and with the number of tickets they break even if enough people come. Merch (sold at shows) remains the number one income.
Of course they have to, but you have to pay A LOT of money to make merch (design, print, record, etc etc etc etc) and even if all cds will be sold out, merch income will be used to pay loans for production.
Well, I can say about my bands, all the members are doing baito or regular work, that’s how they’re living, plus doing records and prints by themselves.
Cheki are merch and you have the jourens shedding at least ¥5000 per taiban on them. Consider 30 come and spend that and you already made about ¥150.000 on like a ¥30.000 investment. On a good day, of course.
Which you can then put forward on renting a studio and producing CDs and T-shirts, or renting the space for the next gig.
Most jourens that go to many shows or support more than 2-3 bands aren’t rich, just have a second job. There’s as much effort put in from the fans as from the bands.
I’m pretty sure bands do appreciate those fans who are vocal online but live far away yet do support with ¥¥¥
Netogya who won’t drop a penny… now those they probably don’t like as much
I forgot who posted it on twitter long time ago
Thats the costs a VK band can count in.
I am also not sure how much those prices are up to date, because i got that since at least some years saved on my laptop.
Feel free to rip those costs apart now.
If you look at bigger bands, The Gazette, Dir en Grey, even non-VK ones like Crystal Lake, you will notice that a lot of them have bandmembers that do some kind of other stuff outside the band. From apperal brand to bars or cafes
I am quite sure they dont do that to get rich, but more, because it gives them a steady income .
Also if you venture outside the VK area you can find Bandmember who are open about their work.
We got Morby from Victim of Deception who works part time at a convinence store, Gen from Hikage works at a small clothing store, Rei from One Eye Closed works as english teacher and so on…
As hard as all other musicians in other countries. Being in a band is expensive and you have to have a considerable number of fans spending a good amount of money on merch just to break even. Making some sort of profit you can keep for yourself is even more difficult, since most of the money they do earn goes back into expenses for the band.
I think VK bands in specific has a bit of an upper hand in this in that they get away with selling cheki. Cheki is easy profit and jouren girls will spend an average of 5000-10000 yen per show. Merch is definitely the biggest money bringer to any non-major band though.
I think the biggest mistake foreign fans make is that they overestimate how popular these bands are. Most of them are still playing gigs in basement venues the size of a garage and the dudes mostly all still have part time jobs. If you want to know how popular a band is or if they’re still relying on a part time for income, look at the venues they play. Kyo probably doesn’t have as much money as say, Johnathan Davis, but he also probably makes a comfortable amount of money from his bands to where he doesn’t have to worry about a part time job.
Not too different to what sports players do. Or Tiktokers. Or models. Or actors. Idk, it’s their hard-worked money and if bangya want to have a sugar baby it’s on them. You do you. Networking and threading around fans is work in itself, without mentioning rehearsals, gigs, etc. How is sitting 9-7 at an office typing on Excel more of an effort than whatever they do? I, for example, did office work and I’m way more exhausted and worn off (but happy too) as a bartender, even though you could argue it requires “no work”.
Also, not all bangya are in it and spending money in hopes of hooking up. A lot of Japanese gyas I know absolutely DO NOT want to cross that bridge.
You almost sound bitter you can’t pull it off yourself, careful there
And yes, most VK bandmen have side gigs doing mundane things. Some skilled enough get to write music for other artists or entities, some have side gigs as musicians in completely different genres (one VK drummer I know plays in a jazz bar sometimes).
I know that a few successful bandmen who have “made it” like Sakito from Nightmare, Hakuei from Penicillin, and Sho from Golden Bomber ghost write songs for things like TV shows and commercials. So that probably pays well too if you can do it.
Oh yes that’s definitely a good side gig. I know a few not so big names who do it too. It’s gotta be sweet to be able to live off music even if for someone else, as opposed to dealing with people over a counter lol
Not all bandmen are that scummy. But a big number of them surely are. Just as there is a big number of scummy predatory men. And any other type of shitty person.
I guess I’ll count my blessings and be happy my honmei says he doesn’t need anything when I ask what he wants present-wise LOL
We see the uglier side of the industry more than ever because of how accessible it has become, but I do not think it’s a recent development.
Ok so I know the ins and outs of this.
Basically the music world is full of pimps and the artists are the hoes.
Being a Prince fan I aimed to free myself from those middle men leaches to where now events seem to know to not even ask me to play norma gigs and one cd shops manager begged me to return and I was like nopeeee.
If you are smart you can make tons of profit even as an indie band.
I take the approach of treating it like say… Local craft beer. You may not be a big company, but if you make something good and of quality, focus on your core customers, you will have success.
As I do everything from production to pressing weve had multiple months of our profit margin being around 150,000en and even 200,000en one month. lots of that has gone back into growing the business and preparing the full album plus covering the cleanup of members suddenly quiting, that set us back months. But still profit is high. Plus I do composition jobs on the side and music is my only job. Got a 6 month Composition contract to help grow the band too this month.
Really any band could do this if they work smarter and not harder/dont let people screw you over.
Recently an artists told me they paid 300,000en for a photoshoot and I was like gurll… you got played.
That kind of stuff happens alot here.
And often labels are the biggest vultures.
Bigger legacy bands like diru etc. You know they are set money wise, houses etc.
Young bands that seem famous and are doing nationwide tours and tied to a label? Probably only geting 2~3man per person a month and then living off of cheki profits.
So sometimes im making more than major artists just by using my head/sacrifing my body haha.
So basically you need to work independently, use your noggin, cut out all unnecessary middle men. But alas: musicians will always be dumbies, crazy, lazy etc. So the pimping continues forever! Capitalism 101
Thank you to everyone overseas who buys everything too the trouble with post offices after corona sucks but you make a big difference for us
Right I was shocked.
But even the price of a certain vk label’s own “photo studio” aka an empty concrete room baffles me but hey! Get yo money eh? If they are stupid enough to pay for it.
Basically the idiot move everyone does now is: overpay to use the same photo studios everyone else has used already, pay someone else to do your makeup etc. Pay someone to edit it without passion or heart etc. The result: generic current era vk band photo money down the drain. there goes your profits! And you spent more on all that than you did on production for your actual music ah… fun stuff!
So many vkei bands are made up of middle/high school dropouts too, so they’re gonna be easy to take advantage of if they haven’t learned enough financial literacy to know if they’re being ripped off. The groups that stick around a while tend to have someone that seems business-savvy and resourceful enough to use their resources wisely because they’re always going to be limited.
Feels like a meme to bring up Jiluka as always but Sena markets himself really well with social media and has been described as the brains behind the whole Jiluka operation. Not all bands have people that are willing or able to be involved enough on a personal level to ensure that the band succeeds.
the trouble with post offices after corona sucks but you make a big difference for us 
money down the drain. there goes your profits! And you spent more on all that than you did on production for your actual music