Their last live dvd seems interesting. Anyone know if it’s on streaming somewhere ?
Born was much better than Razor.
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THOMAS mentioned!
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ONE OF US ! ONE OF US !
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OMG yay! I gotta make a Thomas thread later 
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Girugamesh sound like girugamesh mainly throughout idk if I can entirely agree with that but I see your point such as the difference between “ALONE” & “Resolution” on their latter album Monster… but they did have a specific formula they keep throughout to the end. And “THE END” and “.” PERIOD are some of their best songs. Their look got softer for sure but it wasn’t like they were ever crazily heavy? I mean their first album single “Shinning” is exactly that melancholy up-beat rush I am talking about and which we see in “Resolution” still in 2013!
I have a hard point pinpointing the change in their ERAs that I could agree on but need to do more research. So far from my ears I hear the electro/pop influence but their formula stays the same. I think thats what you mean by Girugamesh perhaps. In essence, both BORN & Girugamesh’s formulas absolutely stayed the same. “Formula” is a weird word but it is true. I grew up loving Linkin Park and needless to say their formula drastically changed later in their career of the songs which only real fans (which there are many) respect, but the original formula was all their most popular songs, its true..
1:42 is glorious…. still the BORN sound
Lyrics are shocking, gazette “Sugar Pain” and “MY DEVIL ON THE BED” are other examples. Once again this is the SHOCK element of this genre..
Yes agree on this. I can hear the electro/pop more. This doesn’t necessarily mean their formula has changed! But very fair. RAZOR does not hit as much but to your point too maybe this is more true to Rouges feelings.
I can believe the, “not used to be taken seriously” at the time part. Does the scene shoot itself in the foot sometimes? I get we judge their looks, lyrics, ideations, but the SOUND should be top of order here.
Definitely not.. lol
BORN’s band is extremely quick and bass lines change every 15-30 seconds they are not overpredictable. NO ONE would guess 1:27 Pyscho Diva chorus change. They are erratic in a beautiful way. They remind me of arelquin in how the band plays.
Also Ryouga’s singing, 2:27 (Psycho Diva) & 1:10 (Blasted Animals) gives me Satoshi vibes the man is unpredictable and beautiful. They sound like a garage band improving vocals without lyrics stretching out the lines at times and it’s GLORIOUS!!!
Beautiful..
Listen to the intro..
It’s the 2nd half of the verse, they made it inside out, replay it (typical) but have a beautiful transcendent fairy ((((lyric mention here)))) sparkly trance-like breakdown ~1:30 before absolutely RIPPING a layered chorus TASTEFULLY FOR 4 BARS ONLY LEAVING ME THIRSTY FOR MORE (which we later get for more) - THIS IS CALLED PRODUCTIONNNNNNNNNNNNN THIS IS ARTTTTTTTT
They looked at this song from the listeners point of view as well from production/sound design rules like this ^ they deserved more.
definitely ..; Yes ? lol
I don’t know, there isn’t one holy truth concerning that. Obviously not putting every single song of them , they have some gems MV and b-sides.
It depends of what you’re used to, and what you tend to listen to.
BORN are definitely not known or popular because they’re creating " outstanding unique out of the box " music, more like because they started in a good company ( at the time rip PS ), have the star factor, and they’re just cool.
Now, it doesn’t mean that their reputation entirely depends on that, and I personally like their music, but I do think it’s predictable, and heard everywhere in VK for a long time, they just do it well ! and in a cool way !
It also explains the " not taken seriously " part. Anyway, concerning this part it’s not my own opinion but just how purist-know-everything were resonating at the time.
Also, i’ve got some news for you about my perception of Arlequin lol
Agreed there is not one holy truth concerning that, but they are definitely not typical…
BORN being known only for their star-factor and those types of reasons other than their sound is super depressing. The sound palettes they use, and the type’s of drum/guitar patterns are similar across ALL of VKEI and Rock, that is why we are here… the whole point is that the unique melodies and assortment of those sound palletes and drum/guitar patterns in their own light defines their “formula” and makes them unique. I would LOVE to hear some more bands you think share this “typical” sound of theirs quite honestly. This is like saying, a piano player playing the same Bach piece sounds the same as another….. it is a lot deeper than this. I fear the scene as a whole does not understand this. Listeners claim they are this obsessed but I feel like I am the true obsessed. I respect your opinion though. The more I have these conversations the more I think about creating something to help the VKEI scene in America. Apologies if I ever come off rough.
What are your unfiltered thoughts on Arlequin? Can you give any examples in songs by chance? It is okay if not, thank you!
This is hilarious. And I agree.
Hearing/feeling like I am closer to them before more polish is beautiful.
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I love your reply thank you for citing some tracks. Agreed the transition was gradual and they added more electro/pop like Girugamesh did with a few tracks being more poppy but TBF on Vigour, listening to “Deep Affection” , “凍結” , “Spiral Lie”, “GAGA SPEAKING” (more electro pop elements) they are undeniably themselves. For them to be less stale they need to experiment, but they cannot experiment too much for fear of losing their fans? identity? … ah… the life of the artist.
Agreed that they have some legendary hits that stand the test of time. They are not forgettable.
Honestly, it’s not that depressing.. It’s just what comes with this kind of band, in VK in general, and particularly with BORN ..
Formula to create a predictable VK song :
Flamboyant Intro , a verse a pre-chorus, a boring chorus, same verse again, little " ooohs " and random badass back vocals from other members for attention, guitar solo / break or drop that goes well for live performances to make the fans move more, bridge, final chorus but with a twist.
Add to that pretty boys and edgy MV and theme. tadaaa.
Now, I know that you’re going to say that it applies to pretty much all the bands in VK. Answer is Yes, BUT, some other bands ( that are less predictable than BORN in this case :)) ) got a better singer, outstanding musicians, or just a different " formula " !
( not that BORN are bad musicians or Ryoga a bad singer/screamer whatever you call that, not at all )
Hopefully it was pretty clear cuz i have no idea how to develop more than that honestly
Other bands that follows it : ScreW( yes I love to give them as an exemple because they’re the typical exemple of don’t work hard work smart, and have a pretty face and star factor too .Even tho just like born they’re great performers ! )
Arlequin started great ! But eventually fell into a tamed polished rabbit hole and lost all their passion.Like, you can literally feel it ! thru their music. ( On top of all the scandals but that’s not even that important ).
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Respectfully that’s crazy that you think that is any typical formula for anything; and 1) They’re all edgy 2) 50% are pretty boys if not all of them? It is VK after all. Not sure I see your point..
Proof: ScreW’s #1 song on Spotify “Spiral of Mistrust” literally has 2? drum patterns throughout the entire son (2:30-2:50 bridge changes). I play piano and my father is a drummer. Are you listening to the actual separation in sound development throughout their songs or do not pay attention to that sort of thing? It should be taken more seriously.. I’m sorry.
please just stick to your own opinion and respect mine I don’t see any more argument I can use and it was never my intent to convince you but you keep pushing.
Just keep thinking that born are outstanding and i’ll keep thinking that they’re nice but commercial ! boom peace in planet earth and the universe
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Don’t get upset just ’cause I shared some objective points about the band’s technical side, especially on a thread I made about them being underrated.. other folks are chiming in without taking it personally. I’ve been keeping it respectful, but it kinda just seems like you’re annoyed now. No hard feelings though. Maybe visual kei just isn’t for everyone here.
The fact is that you seem like you’re getting pressed because i’m not going your way. you’ve commented three times " sorry respectfully it’s just my opnion " while infantilizing mine and trying to change it AND sprinkle pseudo double edged polite sentences.
My last comment wasn’t annoyed or rude, I’m just entitled to my image of BORN and at the same time respect yours, really.
Also assuming " Visual Kei isn’t for anyone here " ?? weird af 
and doesn’t even need to be answered.
Have a nice day and all that .
I’m sorry you think your awful and disrespectful description of the god tier BORN or VK music in general was not respected and acknowledged, respectfully of course
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Alright guys, end of argument. Back to BORN discussions, please.
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I bought some CDs, live DVDs and even a t-shirt. I love them on stage and style in MVs. They are very charismatic. but I have to say that - for me, their songs are hit or miss.
Their discography is something crazy for me. Devilish of the punk is the one of my favorite songs of all time but b-sides from this single hmmm… they are. Just it. And I can tell it about more releases.
Album Vigour is strange case for me. Separately songs are good and I’m enjoying them. But when listen whole album it makes me “heavy”. I tried few times but results were the same.
About RAZOR, I listen them because Ryoga. They really good but I miss this craziness from BORN.
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