We realized para-social anything is gross obtained by walking outside breathing in oxygen then getting in our car driving to work and going “Oh yeah, social media is fake! none of those fashion trends or aesthetics mattered those band dudes or women are just the same as us”
A long time ago a normal girl on TikTok posted that she couldn’t afford the latest fashion trend and was planning to go out to a bar she felt so scared wearing some crop top and thought “Oh god they are going to think this is so outdated! I’m going to be made fun of it’s the end of my life” kind of thoughts (cause big fk u to TikTok)
However she went to the bar and when she came back she said “Everyone was complimenting me I had a nice time out my doom scrolling thoughts about my fit went away I realized at that moment that we were so plugged into what this single app thinks of us it has shaped our entire lives from the way we dress, what we buy to even what we think and so, take this as a sign to unplug from the internet and go hang out in real life”
When you spend so much time plugged into social media that it begins to effect your thoughts and actions thats when you should think “oh wow, I should really pull away from this” looking at you vkei tiktokers making edits right now
This is funny (just from my personal perspective) because for me it’s rather the other way around somehow. I’ve always found that androgynous look most attractive and that’s part of what got me hooked with VK because it’s more prominent there than anywhere else.
However these people can look attractive as hell that will make me take a look at them maybe but if the music ain’t to my liking no look will help. I might keep an eye on the band/project but rather to know where the people turn to next than for the respective band/project itself. Until there’s music again that I like (while listening to ohter bands/projects/songs that I do like/love).
So yeah, the visual aspect was part of what attracted me but it’s still not what you’re referring to and that’s why I think it’s funny.
I fully understand that people have a type they prefer over others. And I don’t mind if the first thing that got you into a band was their visuals.
The thing for me is more the amount of fans that have starred so much at VK bandmember that that’s the only thing they think is attractive anymore.
Yeah, what I was talking about is sexual attraction basically.
I am not saying you’re not allowed to think of VK bandmember as attractive, but I think it becomes unhealthy if that is your standard and you started to have unrealistic standards for a partner or potential future partner.
Alright I’m out of it then because I’m ace so there’s no sexual attraction for me anyway (in like I don’t understand it out of experience).
And I agree with the rest you say.
Oh Romantically interest counts too, I think that more understandable from your personal point, but correct me if I should be wrong
(I forgot to add that when I wrote it , my brain was searching the word but forgot it)
I’m also aro so I also don’t unterstand that attraction from own experience.
To me not even physical aspects are really important. Of course, there’s some kinda ideal version or how to call it but it’s not really important and it holds some aesthetics and these are androgynous so this is one of the attractions that do work for me (I can’t really explain what attracts me in the end because I can’t pinpoint it myself yet; I also differ between sexual and sensual attraction, but well, I guess that starts getting into a direction that it wasn’t supposed to xDD). I guess that keeps me from putting these expectations into people that I do meet.
Overall it’s pretty complex. But actually that doesn’t really matter because the point about no expectations counts way more I think. And in the end it just matters to the people involved and talking about all of this is a very good way to prevent too many unfulfilled expectations and misunderstandings (really, despite expectations that are too much out of anything real I think that people do talk too little about their needs, preferences, dislikes, no-go’s etc. until things turn into a big mess and everybody ending up hurt when relationships end).
New unpopular opinion time, but why regurgitate a point that was made perfectly in a YouTube video:
Every heavy visual kei band needs to watch this band. I wish there were subs in Japanese
Basically, limitations breed creativity. Zak makes the legit point that using power chords, perfect fourths, tritones, and palm muting, along with dialing in the amp sound, is an awesome way to capture a heavy, aggressive tone in standard tuning. Maybe more than one visual kei band chose Drop A, Drop B, or Drop C because “that’s what everybody else does”, but you don’t necessarily need drop tuning to have a heavy sound. Consider Open C (CGCGCE), Celtic Tuning (DADGAD), or even F Standard!
Maybe it’s because I’ve been on a massive “グリーヴァ” / “Marvelous Cruelty” binge, but a part of me is quite happy that bands like “キズ” and “鐘ト銃声” are taking off, with guitars that are more aligned with what I’m talking about. I don’t necessarily dislike the current direction of the scene, but I would hate for new bands to feel pressured to tune lower than they’d prefer.
recently there’s one person called saki rose who did some covers on youtube that were popular with diru fans and for some reason as talented as they are vocally, their whole demeanor is annoying as hell to me - idk if it’s just me because the vk twt fans seem to eat it up and they seem to like saki.
to me they embody the typical loud obnoxious american and until recently i didnt really have a reason to dislike them other than their vibe lol. but idk man when reita passed it just seemed that saki commented about it in a way which TO ME seemed like it was with the intention of getting more traction to their page e.g. commenting under some gazette member’s post with condolences (i dont remember who exactly), and then doing a buck tick cover right after atsushi’s death as i guess that’s the peak time for them to gain attention. idk how to explain it but they strike me as using any and every opportunity to get attention lol and passing it off as “paying respect to the artist”.
i guess attention seeking and opportunistic is the word i’m looking for. their tweets also do the most for attention and idk dude lol. now, before any of their listeners come to bash me: i dont care and wish them all the best. they just irritate me and strike me as an incredibly loud and childish which are traits i despise lol.
You have 710 posts of unpopular opinions and hot takes
And I think most of us on here don’t have a good opinion on vktwt
It’s a difficult place where the only thing you can do is block people that annoy you
my bad, i thought my post would be a separate post but it got posted here which is why i started out like that lol. i’ve edited my comment to fit the thread
and that’s honestly a relief to know i’m not the only one with such an opinion on vktwt bcs good lord.
No problem, we have a lot of already existing threads, sometimes you need to search
And if you can’t find one, make your own thread like you made, and we mods push it into the right thread if needed.
Regarding vktwt, I have had saki rose on my timeline once in a while. She comes a lot over like the classic small artist that is trying to get enough attention for her projects, so I would care too much.
Mute the account or block them.
That’s what I did with Omerta (they are not japanese) when they became obnoxious and my timeline started to be unwillingly filled with them.
I am pulling this out again to point at it, because why everyone on Twitter is measuring Jiluka, a VK band that makes metalcore, on Kpop groups???
Or is that just a case of “All Asians look the same”?
(I am glad at least you all on here have understood at least that part )
I mean, it should be judged by that standard, but when you see who is bringing them over and the cross section of VK/K-pop fans that exists, it makes sense that some people would come to that conclusion.
It’s why I think that Jiluka’s primary barrier to entry isn’t even the Japanese part, it’s the fan culture surrounding VK that has only gotten more pervasive within the overseas fandom over time with the increasing ease of 1) Going to Japan, and 2) Moving to Japan, and 3) Social Media, and the increasing popularity of following accounts who do a lot of #1 and #2.
Well, back when the overseas fandom was still pretty new and getting it’s bearings (1999-2002, the era of fan websites, multiple smaller forums, live journal, Winamp stations, etc you know the drill), it was pretty rare to find people who lived in Japan and actively went to lives. There were a couple of people who had blogs, like Go from Glam Japan, or the woman who brought Duel Jewel over after spending a bit of time in Japan.
But the explanations that they gave were typically phrased in a way that westerners with zero Japanese knowledge could understand. Nobody really cared about the “proper” terminology for everything. We were still calling furitsuke “Para Para”. Practically no one was fixated on terms like “honmei” or “oshi”. There were people that behaved in what would be called a “fan girl/ fan boy” manner, but they were still doing so in ways that an outsider could understand.
And it was even rarer to find someone who lived in Japan, attended lives, but was there for so long that they started looking down on other foreigners for not fully immersing themselves in the exact customs of the Japanese fandom, even when said foreign fans weren’t affecting them in any way from half way across the world.
Now, it seems like people getting into the fandom care a lot more about emulating the Japanese fandom even if they’ve never been to a live in Japan (and honestly? Might move on before they ever get a chance to). So they study accounts from lifestyle bangya, trying to cram as much info as possible, followed by said bangya venting about how other foreigners “just don’t get it” due to this increased engagement from n00bs that they’re getting.
Drama ensues. And all the while, the fans (both old and new) who become too insular in the VK community risk bringing all of that to overseas shows and potentially scaring away the casuals (which, hey, people can enjoy it however they want at overseas shows. It’s the main distinguishing factor vs Japanese shows, imo).
I wonder how much of your description relates to simulacra and simulation. Instead of my long-winded diatribes, I’ll cut right to the mustard:
The first order would be actually being part of the scene. Going to lives in Japan, meeting band members, learning proper live etiquette, connecting with other Japanese fans, etc. This is the original and there is no copy. Along with this physical aspect of the scene is the mental aspect of the scene: what is visual kei, what the definitions are, and how someone is impacted and shaped by the art they consume.
The second order would be footage of lives circulated on DVD. The nature of the content has been preserved, because we’re still dealing with elements of the scene of some sort, but they’ve been put to work. This step has to do with how we use the content from the first stage, what we make out of it, and most importantly how people interact with it. Naturally, those in Japan will take a different experience away from those in the international scene. From a geographical and mental aspect, international fans are largely distanced from the actual performance. You might be able to watch the DVD, but you can’t transport yourself to that location, you don’t know what being part of the local scene is like, and your brain has to do work to fill in the rest. This is a distorted view of reality.
The third stage has to imply the massive circulation of the content from stage one. Think of GIFs created from their music videos or live recordings, or select pictures from a promotional set. These images are widely used, they don’t have an original, but we can recognize the visual kei in it. We might even be able to recognize the exact performance the DVD stems from! But at this point, we are several layers removed from the original, and instead of witnessing a distorted reality, reality is just gone. In other words, we are not watching an entire performance and picking up cues from it. We are watching a GIF and constructing our own reality to tie together what’s missing in a way that is satisfactory to us, with no need to cross-reference with each other or even reality!
This is where the big shift happens. At the final stage, we’re watching an anime based on the struggles of a fictional visual kei band. It’s an anime, something that only tangentially touches upon the scene. It has nothing to do with the scene from the beginning, even though we recognize it. The idea of visual kei is important for the anime to work and it’s accomplished through the use of conventions and patterns important to the scene, but that’s it. But in order to get to this point, we have to know so many things about visual kei - how the scene works, how fashion works, how it’s structured - that this is the point where signs reflect other signs.
I believe a lot of people drift between two and four, completely untethered from reality, not realizing that the scene they idolize exists mostly in their mind. And I’ve witnessed this kind of thing for so long, that I don’t think there’s any reaching them. Let them live in their delusion, I guess.
A part I also wanna point out is that all of us are stuck at two by default, since we’re not in Japan. I guess that’s where a lot of elitism about experiencing the real thing comes from.
Here’s a meme if you didn’t understand what I wrote.
” and not having a drivers licences…
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